India Update – Present Situation
A monk from Sera Monastery wrote about the present situation:
- The Shugden portion from Pomra Khangtsen at Sera Mey (about 120-130 monks and novices) is not attracting any new Tibetan monks as those who come into exile do so in the spirit of being close to HHDL.
- Most of the Tibetan Pomras have left the Khangtsen and re-joined Sera Mey. Especially the young monks want no part in the vitriol of the more militant leaders who now largely control the breakaway faction. The nasty rhetoric spewing forth from several of the leaders of the faction against the Dalai Lama, in the words of this monk “literally had the monks running out the door back to the majority faction of the monastery.” The nasty comments and lies are so poisonous even many monks loyal to Shugden cannot stand it and have left the monastery altogether.
- Because of lack of numbers, Shugden practising Pomras have been going to Nepal to recruit young children (7-12) to join their house. They do this because most Tibetans wishing to ordain cannot take the taste of their vitriol against the Dalai Lama. The Nepali children are sent to the monastery by their parents because there is free room and board, but are usually called back by their parents when old enough to work in the fields. For this reason, they don’t finish their studies but serve only the purpose of bolstering the numbers of the Shugden faction in Pomra Khangtsen.
- From a young age these Nepali children are being taught to hate the Dalai Lama, that he is a destroyer of dharma, etc. In fact, one monk told me the Shugden leaders of Pomra are making use of the tension between Nepali and Tibetan monks to further their cause.
- Some Tibetan Shugdens at Sera who are not part of the militant wing have been shocked by the claims on the WSS website that this is a false Dalai Lama. They believe the tactics of these Western neophytes to Buddhism have harmed their cause more than helped it. This is according to one Shugden follower I spoke to in Delhi.
- Despite threats from Shugden worshippers, His Holiness the Dalai Lama will perform hundreds of bhikshu ordinations for novice monks of both Sera Mey and Jey this year around Losar at Sera Monastery.
- His Holiness has continued to withdraw from any political responsibilities in order to allow the Tibetans to take charge of their own future. This indicates all the talk about him being a dictator is baseless. The current meeting is being held largely in his absence, and on Phayul you can read a document where he begs the Tibetans to discuss every option openly.
- The above information comes from 3 members of Sera Mey monastery and 1 Geshe from Sera Jey monastery. In addition, I spoke with one monk loyal and a layperson to Shugden in Majnu Katilla settlement, Delhi.
- By all accounts the situation at Sera, despite the anti-Dalai Lama vitriol of some Shugden monks in the breakaway faction of Pomra Khangtsen, is largely peaceful. In fact, the demands of WSS have already been met! Both sides are continuing their practices without interruption and, through the division into two monasteries , there has been little conflict to mention the past two months. Both sides have kept all their own buildings and no one is homeless as a result of this dispute.
- The seperation has in fact eased tensions and made it easier for both sides to focus on their divergent goals.
Annotation
France 24 TV and Al Jazeera claimed there would be 4 million Buddhist Tibetans worshipping Shugden. It seems both media didn’t verify the claims they took over from Shugden supporters for their reports. More than 10 years ago the New Kadampa Tradition (NKT) and their members spread already this wrong information via their sub-organisation Shugden Supporters Community (SSC). Two British media consulted specialists and pointed out that this claim is grass exaggeration.
Andrew Brown from The Independent wrote:
“The figure of four million worshippers of Shugden was preposterous. There are only about six million Tibetans in the world at most, of whom less than half are members of the Gelugpa order (Steven Lane estimated 30 per cent), where the veneration of Shugden is concentrated. Even among the Gelugpa, only monks can be initiated into the cult of Shugden, and only a minority of those actually are. Most of the experts I talked to thought that about 100,000 people at most could be affected by the Dalai Lama’s ban.”
Peter Unwin stated:
“The figure of four million worshippers is grass exaggeration, experts estimating the figure to actually be around 100,000 or less than 2% of the Tibetan population, a large proportion of whom abandoned propitiation of the deity after the Dalai Lamas pronouncements.”
see also: Review and Present Situation 2008/07/24
Tenzin -
:-D
so i suppose this’ll be more lies, then? http://wisdombuddhadorjeshugden.blogspot.com/2008/11/dorje-shugden-practitioners-denied.html
dougal
November 17, 2008 at 5:04 pm
dougal what’s your problem?
I don’t operate with the term “lies”. Why? A view is no lie. If someone holds a different view than oneself this also constitutes no lie. Even if someone states something as a fact which after close investigation turns out to be wrong, this is no lie. A lie is conscious wrong speech. To judge something as a lie one either has to know the mind of the other person or must be sure, that the person knows it better and is consciously stating the opposite of what he knows. Therefore, to be careful to judge statements of others as “lies” seems to be a good advice, isn’t it?
I just glanced the passage of your website your link is referring to. There is nothing to say for me. Why? I don’t know what your sources are, but I know how unreliable and misleading NKT is operating with what they label as “the truth”. Fortunately, I have my own sources and regard them as far more reliable. Also the understanding how NKT / WSS operates and spins the facts helps me to put things into perspective.
Tenzin Peljor
November 17, 2008 at 6:57 pm
Thanks for posting this update!
henrique
November 18, 2008 at 9:50 am
Hi,
Thank you for updating us with this latest yet reliable info about present situation in India.
As for those who are still ignorance and refuse to have an open mind to see the truth, they are ‘always’ have problem and issues when reliable source and information been reveal, they will become aggressive for their propaganda of the ‘truth’ with ‘their own reliable sources and link’ which are self-generated. However, the more they do that, the more ignorance and narrow minded which they have all these while can reveal to the public.
lhundrup
November 18, 2008 at 11:54 am
There are two sides to every story. Perhaps your readers would also be interested in the story of sixteen young refugees in Nepal and India: http://wisdombuddhadorjeshugden.blogspot.com/2008/11/story-of-16-young-tibetan-refugees-in.html
comment TP
There are not only two sides of a story, there are many different perspectives.
The question is how reliable a source of information is, what the background, perception and motivation of the informant is and if those people who are hearing the information understand them well and are able to put things into perspective or if they are rather following propaganda and a narrow minded approach. My pov is NKT and WSS are both making propaganda, very misleading propaganda, and their reliability is rather zero. People who praise exaggerations, wrong information and misleading statements as “the truth” are not reliable for me…
Jimmy
November 20, 2008 at 9:07 pm
Well of course everything you mention here could with equal validity be said about the reliability of your sources of information, depending on whether you and they believe the Dalai Lama or believe others. It is, as you say, all a matter of perspective, and this perspective comes from one’s world view. Your world view is that the NKT is dreadful and that Shugden is a demon and so on. This leads you to a passionate belief in your own perspective that informs everything you read and hear about the NKT and the WSS. It may work the other way around too, of course, but you have to admit that your point of view is not the only reliable point of view?
Jimmy Marsden
November 21, 2008 at 11:43 pm
No Jimmy. I am from East Germany, a communist country well used to censorship and manipulation, and served in the East German army, so I know how propaganda is functioning and how it works. It is not a matter of belief it is a matter of being open to all the facts and putting the puzzle together instead of looking all the time only in the same corner of the room. To look always in the same corner of the room won’t allow you to get a full perspective of the room.
What ever my world view is, mainly I don’t like if people contort the facts and state untruths to mislead others or lead them to hate. I had already difficulties with this in East Germany, with the Stasi and in the army. I didn’t expect to find this in Buddhism. I learned it better.
As there are different pov the point is to be able to get the full picture. In Buddhism this topic is well explained with the example of the elephant. Do you know this example. It’s very enlightened. I will look in the next days if I find a quote online and add it here.
best wishes, tenzin
Tenzin Peljor
November 22, 2008 at 6:53 am
Yes, Tenzin, I know the story of the elephant. But has it not occurred to you that you have also been adversely influenced by your time with the Stasi, such that you still hold onto views that you yourself find difficult to shake over in your corner of the room? That you are not as clear on all this as you might think you are? Of course no one likes it if “people contort the facts and state untruths to mislead others or lead them to hate”. Can you not see that from another perspective this is exactly what you are doing yourself, causing many people to develop doubts and hate of the NKT and Shugden practice? How do you know that you are not, without realizing it, using your understanding of propaganda to spread it against others? best wishes, J
Jimmy Marsden
November 22, 2008 at 7:07 pm
Regarding your first three sentences: of course.
Regarding the last two sentences: I think, the best protection is openness, being unbiased, learning the facts, and also trying to be open to make faults and being open to recognize, accept and correct them. Also to put things into perspective by using common sense and discriminative intelligence is helpful.
If you think (this is not my aim!) that:
I would “cause many people to develop doubts and hate of the NKT and Shugden practice?” I wonder why you are not worried that NKT might cause others to “develop doubts and hate of the Dalai Lama and Gelug school and those opposing Shugden practice?”
Regarding your last question: I could also use my knowledge about cults to set up a cult and to establish myself as a cult leader, but I am not interested. When I recognized the harm of dictatorships, be it the Nazis, the East-German-Communists or the Buddhist dictatorship (NKT) and understandood their means, this knowledge is no inspiration for me to follow that example but to try to avoid these faults, because I asked myself what led to these events and what is in my mind which supports such developments. On a personal level, these are great teachings of what should not be done, and what is to be avoided by myself.
I think, there is always the risk to follow a bad direction, be it individually or collectively. What helps is to be aware, to be open and self-critical, and to have good and sincere spiritual friends who are wise or at least rely on the wise. Of course sometimes foolishness appears as being wise and wisdom appears as foolishness. Even demons can appear as Buddhas and Buddhas can appear as demons. So one has to be aware and open, and to develop discriminative intelligence to see what is right and what is wrong (in the conventional world), impartial compassion is a good means to more wisdom and openness.
So what can be done, I think, is to protect the own mind by constantly improving and rectifying one’s understanding and practice of the Dharma.
best wishes, t
Tenzin Peljor
November 23, 2008 at 5:46 pm
I just found this. For the sake of remaining open, unbiased and so on, perhaps your readers could also look at a very different point of view of the same situation:
[[link deleted by blog owner]]
I understand this to-ing and fro-ing could go on forever. Luckily we know that everything is projection of mind and no one’s opinion is truly valid or invalid. At the end of the day, people are just going to have to make up their own minds about what to believe and how to act — and perhaps a lot of that will depend on their karma, which karmic appearances to mind they are experiencing.
It is good, I think you will agree, to make sure that differing points of view are out there. Your point of view is now very well known.
Jimmy Marsden
November 24, 2008 at 1:22 am
Dear Jimmy,
the post above is not my opinion, it is the quote of a report by a monk affiliated with Sera Monastery. What I quote is not necessarily my opinion. At the end of the report by the monk I added 3rd party sources correcting wrong claims made by WSS/NKT or some few media WSS/NKT like to quote as those who ‘state the truth’. That’s it.
I do not promote the propaganda of NKT, therefore I deleted this time your link. As long as NKT is following strictly a completely self-referential system, only linking to their own web sites, spins the facts, and tries even to promote their links at my blog by abusing the “open approach statement” as a door entry, I see no need to support their propaganda too much here. I’ve already approved two times the blog you were linking. People interested can follow them or use Google.
Best wishes.
Tenzin Peljor
November 24, 2008 at 2:03 pm
I admit this whole thing got out of hand and we did not see in from far or from near.
Conclusion
we do not have to worry about HH or any holy people but check up your own mind.
myself I am ignorant.
guruji
February 4, 2009 at 10:08 am
anyone who likes to get out of confusion talk to me and be enlightened…
?
conflict mediator
February 4, 2009 at 11:33 am
Dear guruji, I agree:
“we do not have to worry about HH or any holy people but check up your own mind.
myself I am ignorant.” tp
Tenzin Peljor
February 4, 2009 at 3:04 pm
Is it Shugden or Yedor?
Recent months saw a surge of sacrilegious rhetoric against the person of His Holiness the Dalai Lama from the Chinese side. One of the prominent among the so-called “authors” was Yeduo or Yedor who purportedly wrote quite a number of articles on the political as well as religious aspects of the Tibetan people, and particularly with regard to His Holiness the Dalai Lama’s person.
In the series is the recent “signed article” from Yeduo, which the official state run Xinhua and People’s Daily heavily depended on with commentaries to the “signed article” of December 12, 2008.
But one must not forget the fact that a part of this “signed article” was already published somewhere. Guess? In the pro-Shugden website: Wisdom Buddha Dorje Shugden Blog under the title, “Tibetan Youth Congress, Red Guards of Tibetan Buddhism” and in “An Open Letter to Tsering, a Monk of Sera Monastery.”
It underscores the identity of that “author” whosoever he may be, with certain connection he may have to both the sides: PRC and Shugden.
One cannot but suspect the relations between the two articles which are ditto in similarities; whether in context or with the “turn of phrase”.
In pro-Shugden article on Tibetan Youth Congress, there are mentions about Jetsun Pema, Ngari Rinpoche and Rinchen Khando Choegyal as having links with the TYC and the TWA. This is of not much significance to speak of but for the way both the sentences wherein the use of the phrases and words are similar is quite alarming.
To the understanding of many China-watchers, Yi Duo or Yedor probably writes in Chinese mandarin. But to have it’s English version similar, both in style and use of phrases, to a particular article already published (in pro-Shugden website) is quite a rare and indigestible (Signed Article Exposes Autocratic Nature of Dalai Clique’s Theocracy dated 12 December 2008 – http://www.chinaview.cn)
Similarly, Yi Duo’s article digs up all those tattletale that pro-Shugden websites rely upon to push their agenda, such as the assassination of Gung Thang Tsultim etc.
Moreover, like the pro-Shugden supporters, Yi Duo’s article also turns to the “stabbing” incident of Kundeling (probably speaking of Kundeling Woeser Gyaltsen, a former Kalon). Although Kundeling Woeser Gyaltsen is no more with us but if one goes according to his own words, he indicated it as handiwork of Shugden supporters (see the Video on Shugden Controversy, Part One, brought out by DIIR) when he was asked about the incident.
Likewise, in ditto pro-Shugdens style, Yi Duo’s article also accuses His Holiness the Dalai Lama and the Tibetan exile administration of persecution of Shugden followers and perpetrating “crimes” such as “beating, arson and murder.”
Here it is pertinent also to mention the “Court Case” that the pro-Shugden followers have filed against His Holiness the Dalai Lama and the Tibetan Govt. in exile, which is hailed by Yi Duo.
If anyone goes by the contents of the case filed by the pro-Shugden petitioners, among whom one is Nga-Lama alias Lobsang Yeshi as Second Petitioner, it would become crystal clear what actually the objective of the particular case is all about.
On the one hand, the Shugden followers claim of being Tibetan and as committed to the cause of Tibet as any other Tibetan. But on the other hand, the court case demands the dismantling of Tibetan Government in exile by questioning the Union Government of India of its existence as illegal in view of the Indian Constitution.
When the Shugden supporters question the existence of Tibetan Government in exile on Indian soil, it means they want it to be closed down. It is a similar proposition that of PRC demanding India not to allow the Tibetans to engage in any political activities against China from Indian soil. Are all Shugden supporters privy to this demand? It is doubtful if every Shugden propitiators know about this and what their leaders are upto!
In spite of differing views and discontent on the functions of the Tibetan Government in exile, it has been a pivotal of Tibetan unity symbolizing political aspirations of the vast majority of Tibetan people.
And those who dream it to meet a dead-end are enemy of the Tibetan people and traitors of the nation.
In these senses, it is irrefutably clear that Yi Duo’s articles and the pro-Shugden articles are akin in their design and function aimed at devastation of Tibetan people’s aspirations, with an objective to serve no one but Chinese communist regime.
Tsering
February 6, 2009 at 6:22 am