New Kadampa Tradition / Kadampa Buddhism & Western Shugden Society

Do New Kadampa Tradition abuse the Charity Status for Political Activities?

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1. If you want an answer to the question above type this into your search engine.

   Charity Commission CC9

   Also,

   http://www.bateswells.co.uk/Files/MediaCoverages/AQuestionOfPolitics.pdf

   

   John Swainson

   December 22, 2009 at 10:50 am

   Reply
2. Thank you John. It shows there is a certain space for campaigning and political activity for charities in the UK laws.

   One needs a specialist to judge this, I think. With respect to one point they say: “A charity can campaign using emotive or controversial material, where this is lawful and justifiable in the context of the campaign. Such material must be factually accurate and have a legitimate evidence base.”, I wonder if the campaign is lawful because it is rather slanderous and is factual inaccurate….

   So finally the Charity Commission or judge should have a look on this, and these people have to decide that case….

   

   tenpel

   December 22, 2009 at 12:20 pm

   Reply
   • Hi tenpel

     Thanks for the reply.

     Yes, I think you are right here but it is difficult to make anything stick. The bodies I have dealt with say they want facts and not opinion. This is such a muddy area. How do we know what is fact here?

     I raise this question because it is vital when making representations to any body that you have evidence.

     Read everything carefully and be sure before acting.

     This sounds like I am defending the NKT but I am not.

     John Swainson

     

     John Swainson

     December 22, 2009 at 2:18 pm

     Reply
     • Thanks John and others. Of course one must act carefully and present evidence. But what type of more evidence is needed – at least to show that NKT is acting politically and that WSS/NKT is of the same entity?

       Additionally to that what has been mentioned here and can be verified by everybody, the CC can ask the internet provider to deliver the data of the owner and admin of the website westernshugdensociety.org and they can contact witnesses of the events of organising the protests. Usually – at least in Germany – one gives the initial evidence and then the authority does the investigation on their own.

       I don’t know how in UK this has to be done… but it seems a bit odd to me that the authority is sleeping and the people have to work for them to do their job ;-)

       It is UK people’s job anyway and it is UK business to judge or to investigate this or not, since NKT are based there and the people of UK pay finally for the campaigning, and if this is correct according to the laws, then everything is fine. It is difficult for me to see the boundaries in this case….

       

       tenpel

       December 22, 2009 at 7:30 pm
3. If you read English Charity law, charities are forbidden to act for political purposes, particularly in any attempt to affect a change of policy in the UK or overseas.

   

   Anon

   December 22, 2009 at 1:07 pm

   Reply
4. Charities CAN campaign for new political policies to be made (animal rights etc) However, they CANNOT campaign to bring about changes in the existing political status quo, at home or overseas. The NKT, in their guise as the WSS are involved in the latter and are therefore breaching charities rules.
   As a result of the benefits of being a charity, the NKT have reaped literally tens of millions of pounds in taxes they would have otherwise had to pay.

   However, the game is up. I am aware of at least four different complainants to the CC over this issue of recent. As ex NKT members become more aware of this fundamental flaw in NKT thinking, and provide the CC with further evidence of the inseparability of the NKT and the WSS, the time for the NKTs little game is running out.

   So, harking back to the statement from within the NKT that they are not ‘continuously under investigation by the CC’, that is true. However, they ARE regulalry investigated by the CC and are presently under scrutiny. Like Al Capone, if we follow the money, we will shut down the mob and its gangster leader.

   

   For Tenpel

   December 22, 2009 at 1:20 pm

   Reply
   • Dear…

     Charity Commission document…

     2) Political activity: Political activity, as defined in this guidance, must only be undertaken by a charity in the context of supporting the delivery of its charitable purposes. We use this term to refer to activity by a charity which is aimed at securing, or opposing, any change in the law or in the policy or decisions of central government, local authorities or other public bodies, whether in this country or abroad. It includes activity to preserve an existing piece of legislation, where a charity opposes it being repealed or amended. This differs from activity aimed at ensuring that an existing law is observed, which falls under (1), Campaigning.

     Political activity might include some or all of:

     raising public support for such a change;
     seeking to influence political parties or independent candidates, decision-makers, politicians or public servants on the charity’s position in various ways in support of the desired change; and responding to consultations carried out by political parties.

     John Swainson

     

     John Swainson

     December 22, 2009 at 2:33 pm

     Reply
5. It does not matter what they call themselves, as far as I can see, if they are a charity , they are allowed to engage in this kind of activity as long as it furthers the stated aim of the charity.

   … the WSS website states that the group ‘…has no leader or registered office’ and why Kelsang Gyatso’s letter to his Centre Directors stated, ‘…demonstrations will be organised by The Western Shugden Society, not by the NKT’ and ‘…the NKT was not organising the demonstrations, the NKT was not involved in political activity’, should be clear.

   This is merely a device to make it difficult to find someone to blame in law.

   The NKT is a registered organisation with officers. The Western Shugden Society,’has no leader or registered office.’

   ‘The Western Shugden Society (WSS) is an ad hoc coalition of Dorje Shugden practitioners from many different countries.’

   So, if they, whoever they are, decide to come together with a specific purpose, without a leader or defined organisational structure, who is accountable?

   The ad hoc coalition will comprise mainly of members of the NKT, but who else cares enough to protest?

   John Swainson

   

   John Swainson

   December 22, 2009 at 9:06 pm

   Reply
   • John,

     Many Tibetans who have been deliberately ostracised from their families and whose Gurus have been proclaimed ignorant by the Dalai Lama care enough to protest. There were many such brave Tibetans at last year’s demonstrations. They are part of the WSS.

     All Shugden practitioners who care about the spiritual impact of the Dalai Lama’s actions of persecution, and who care about human rights, care enough to protest.

     

     Lineageholder

     December 29, 2009 at 12:41 pm

     Reply
     • Hi Lineageholder

       I was using a broad brush when I said ‘who else cares?’ A broad brush is a very crude instrument so apologies.

       Having read the Charity Commission document as to whether a charity can involve itself in political activity I cannot understand why the NKT are so keen to deny political activity when it says they can, as long as it is not the reason for their existence in the first place.

       Tenpel, your questions about using the resources of a charity to campaign are answered in the Commission’s documentation as being acceptable, as long as it is not their only function.

       Lineageholder, your comment about faith in Kadampa Buddhism being destroyed by allegiance to the Dalai Lama does not reflect my experience.

       When I was introduced to the Dorje Shugden issue at my centre, I had difficulty with understanding the problem, I was very pro NKT at the time. What the hell is going on?

       My later rejection of the NKT was nothing to do with this issue, but with the lack of ‘fit’ between what was happening from day to day with what I was being ‘told on the cushion.’

       When I found my experience was not unique, then questions were asked.

       Moving on to the Dorje Shugde practitioners outside England. Yes, I would hate to find myself in a situation described by some of the early reports about victimisation because of what I believed to be a legitimate form of practice.

       Having seen the photographs of the new Dorje Shugden temples etc. I wonder how all these downtrodden people who are shunned by all manage to find the materials to build their new premises and, support such, when they have been been ostracised by all.

       Just try getting a plumber in England when you need one, never mind whether he agrees with your religious practice!

       I have spent many an hour reading Tibetan history and read ‘Holder of the White Lotus’ by Alexander Norman.

       From these it would appear that religion and politics have been intertwined in Tibetan history just as they have been in England.

       Finally, I leave with this extract from Stephen Batchelor

       *
       Speaking of the British monarchy more than a hundred years ago, Walter Bagehot warned of ?letting daylight into magic.? This happens today as the media peer into events that formerly only a handful of lamas and their advisors would have been privy to. The arcane wrangling and intrigue surrounding the reincarnations of the Karmapa and the Panchen Lama are disseminated through newspapers, web sites, television and radio within hours of having taken place, while grisly murders in Dharamsala lead to Dorje Shugden being dissected on the pages of Newsweek. The Dalai Lama in particular has used the media to great effect, but the fascination he has both drawn upon and stimulated now threatens to turn the magic of Tibet into mere spectacle.

       If we strip away the exotic veneer of this Tibetan Buddhist dispute, we are confronted with questions which concern the very nature of the dharma and its practice. In the West we are fond of portraying Buddhism as a tolerant, rational, non-dogmatic and open-minded tradition. But how much is this the result of liberal Western(ized) intellectuals seeking to construct an image of Buddhism that simply confirms their own prejudices and desires?

       Historically, Buddhists everywhere have tended not to exhibit the pluralist, postmodern values we might imagine them to possess. All Buddhist traditions make claims to truth, and when those claims have contradicted one another, then passionate, prolonged, even violent disputes have ensued. All the more so is this the case in the polytheistic buddhocracy of Tibet, where a very human dispute between different doctrinal camps has also inevitably been a struggle among the gods. Each side has invoked its own invisible beings for blessing and protection, summoned its own oracles for guidance from them, and been convinced that it was acting out of compassion for the welfare of all beings. Tibetan lamas take their disputes seriously not merely because of short-term political gain. Many of them act out of deep and sincere passion for what they hold to be true.

       Yet history also teaches us that Buddhism possesses a remarkable capacity to reimagine itself in response to the challenges posed by new historical and cultural situations. Its protean forms are testimony to the survival of a way of life that has travelled throughout Asia and is now taking its tentative first steps in America and Europe. If it is to survive, it will have to find a way of preserving the heartfelt, single-minded commitment at its core within multicultural societies that reject the totalizing and potentially repressive demands of any single claim to truth.

       John Swainson

       

       John Swainson

       December 30, 2009 at 5:18 pm
     • Thank you John.

       Yes, if the Charity Laws allow political activities when it is not the main activity of the Charity Trust, then everything is fine. But then I wonder why ex-NKT UK people were stressing this point?

       With respect to your thought “I cannot understand why the NKT are so keen to deny political activity when it says they can”, I think, NKT is so keen to deny political activity because the NKT constitution – as far as it was said by former NKT members – does not allow political activities, hence it would be against the own constitution to perform political activities.

       Another, and far more important, point is that Geshe Kelsang established under his followers this idea of “purity” and that “political activities” are something dirty contrary to Dharma. He used this already when he was still one of two resident teachers at the Priory to criticise Lama Yeshe and to establish his own approach as being better than Lama Yeshes’s approach to Dharma. (see also Mixing Dharma with Politics or Kay 2004) This conception of purity in the sense of “not mixing Dharma with politics” forms a main feature of NKT’s identity and how they distinguish themselves to be better than other Buddhist schools, especially Gelugpa and HHDL but also Tibetan Buddhism in general. It gives most NKT followers a pride to be more pure or better than the Dalai Lama or Tibetan Buddhism because these people do something very bad: mixing Dharma with politics.*

       Since this self-created distinction** forms the core of NKT’s self and is a distinguished feature to rise above Tibetan Buddhism it is, I think, quite shocking to realize that oneself is now involved in politics. So I think, this apparent contradiction between the promulgated purity of not making politics but on the other hand being involved in politics is something very essential with respect to the self-identity of NKT, it is maybe threatening, hence there is a strong rejection and claim : we are not involved in politics. I think, it is like one discovered a side in one’s own personality one has criticised and always seen and promulgated as bad in others but now the vague idea comes up, one may have the same ‘weakness’, this can be felt to be very threatening and confusing.

       So I think NKT are so keen to deny political activity because it threatens directly the self of NKT: we are pure, we do not mix Dharma with politics. This belief froms an essential part of NKT’s identity. Hence to reject to be involved in politics is of paramount importance.

       Remarks:
       * How important this conception is can be seen at the WSS website where they denounce even the 5th and 13th Dalai Lama because “Originally the Dalai Lamas were pure followers of Je Tsongkhapa devoted to their spiritual lives and benefitting others, uninvolved in politics. From the Fifth Dalai Lama onwards, the institution became corrupt. The later Dalai Lamas engaged in actions that would be considered unacceptable by any ordinary person, let alone someone who claims to be the embodiment of enlightened compassion.” Now to have to acknowledge to be involved themselves in politics undermines the self identity of NKT’s “pure self” as well as almost all of their criticism to the Dalai Lama. Much of the NKT ‘propaganda’ would collapse when they had to acknowledge, yes we are involved in politics. Personally, I always referred to this conception of “not mixing Dharma with politics” to be nothing else than politics. I think, to establish such a conception is already politics. The politics of Geshe Kelsang made him the sole spiritual guide of NKT, removing everyone on a same or higher spiritual level.

       ** The term “pure” has different meanings in Buddhism. If one uses pure in the sense of being free from the eight worldly concerns this doesn’t necessarily exclude political actions because political actions can be free from the eight worldly concerns and they can be the activity of a Bodhisattva who is committed also to fulfil the temporal happiness of beings. The Buddha himself was many times in former lives a Bodhisattva king. So the application of pure in the sense of “free from politics” is a self-created conception since it cannot be found in the Sutras or the great Indian Shastras. It is also wrong by applying logic because if one posits “mixing Dharma with politics” to be impure or bad one must apply this consequently to Buddha’s former lives where he lived and acted as a Bodhisattva king-ruler and practised Dharma and politics together. NKT do not read the Jataka stories as the early Kadampa had done, hence there is a lot of not-knowing which supports such narrow minded and wrong views.

       Addition: Also one of the NKT followers blogs claim now that the “primary blame for the “catastrophic decline” of Buddhadharma in Tibet over the past few hundred years, which ultimately precipitated the loss of the country to the Chinese, rests solely on the unholy mixing of religion and politics…” In such a context, if NKT are “accused” to be involved in politics themselves, this thoroughly shakes the ideological agit-prop empire of NKT, that’s why LH and other NKT followers will do their best to claim NKT are not involved in politics. (From a factual pov it was the 13th Dalai Lama who predicted the loss of the country. And according to the history literature I read, it appears very strongly that it were mainly the aristocrats and the most conservative Gelug establishment (very often affiliated with Shugden worship) who undermined the reforms of the 13th Dalai Lama and hindered the change of Tibet to the better and contributed thereby to its destruction but not the Dalai Lama.)

       

       tenpel

       December 30, 2009 at 9:10 pm
6. I found this:
   “Charities and Restrictions on Political Activities: Developments by the Charity Commission for England and Wales in Determining the Regulatory Barriers”
   http://www.icnl.org/KnoWleDge/ijnl/vol11iss1/special_3.htm

   

   tenpel

   December 23, 2009 at 12:04 pm

   Reply
7. You appear to have delineated a very strong matter against NKT, charities law.

   Yes, an animal rights charity could campaign for animal rights.

   But, NKT is not campaigning for its rights. The Tibetan government and Tibetan monasteries have no rule or influence over NKT. NKT makes this very clear in everything it does. NKT’s campaigning against TGIE, the Dalai Lama and what NKT calls corrupt Tibetan Buddhism is nowhere to be found in its charity status. The targets of NKT’s political attacks have no impact on NKT’s rights whatsoever.

   Nevertheless, NKT has taken substantial public money to further their political battle.

   

   Another_Anon

   December 23, 2009 at 12:41 pm

   Reply
8. I am just asking questions based on emails I received.

   NKT has made clean clear, since more than 20 years now, that they are “completely independent” and that the Dalai Lama plays no role in NKT and has nothing to say whatsoever, but contrary to this Helen Gradwell claims in her letter to the Committee on Foreign Affairs:

   “In the UK alone there are thousands of Shugden practitioners who are suffering both materially and spiritually due to the Dalai Lama’s negative policies.”

   What is the evidence for this claim? How do NKT suffer? Are they arrested, banned, are protests been made against them? No, there is nothing NKT suffer on behalf of the Dalai Lama.

   Another interesting sidetrack of this is how NKT claimed now over years to be “pure” by not “mixing Dharma with politics” but Geshe Kelsang states clean clear, they are practising politics. If one understands that Geshe Kelsang uses this concept of “mixing Dharma with politics” as a means to denounce other masters, including Lama Yeshe or HHDL, and to establish NKT’s purity and uniqueness, it is obvious – for a non-NKT follower, that these conceptions collapse in face of his own sayings.

   

   tenpel

   December 23, 2009 at 1:47 pm

   Reply
9. NKT is not involved in political activities. The opposition to the political ban of Dorje Shugden by the Dalai Lama has been conducted by the Western Shugden Society which consists of both Western, Tibetan and other Dorje Shugden practitioners who have been directly affected by the Dalai Lama’s ban. Even these activities are not political as their purpose is to protect the pure doctrine of Je Tsongkhapa as transmitted by the very Lineage Gurus that the Dalai Lama has had the audacity to criticise for their practice of Dorje Shugden. They are the heart of Je Tsongkhapa’s tradition, not him.

   It is true that since NKT rely upon Dorje Shugden, WSS activities have been supported by NKT practitioners but no NKT money has been used to fund the activities of the WSS. This money has come from donations to the WSS or money from the private individuals involved in the protests. It’s their freedom to use their money for these purposes if they wish to.

   NKT income is used solely to run NKT Centres and any profits are donated to the International Temples Project. It’s impossible for NKT funds to be used for any other purpose, as explained by the Internal Rules of the NKT-IKBU which is a legally binding document.

   I think it’s ironic that the NKT’s critics (the Dalai Lama’s followers) falsely accuse it of using money for political purposes when the Dalai Lama and his cronies have been collecting money for a ‘Free Tibet’ for years with no results whatsoever to show for all the money they’ve had and no traceability or accountability. Where HAS it all gone? At least NKT income is accountable – There are published accounts and it’s either in centres or in the International Temples Fund.

   This latest accusation is yet another example of the Dalai Lama’s hypocrisy. Never mind, not long now until the new WSS book is readily available to everyone and they will be able to see this hypocrisy clearly for themselves.

   

   Lineageholder

   December 28, 2009 at 8:55 pm

   Reply
10. I see LH, you oppose Geshe-la who said this issue is political? Its only about 7 years ago that he said that. I hope you are not a RT otherwise he may remove you from your position for opposing his pov as he has done with LJ because she opposed him too ;-)

    Thank you for your short summery about the finances, I don’t know if this is the case or not. Maybe it is true, maybe not. We’ll see. However, it is very clear that NKT uses their charity structure for the protests. Where is the financial report of the WSS, who runs the wss website, where the booklets have been designed and created, what Tharpa office, Tharpa software or computer was used…. There are a lot of open questions.

    NKT critics are not primary Dalai Lama followers but former NKT members. Dorje said this different times to you also on the Tricycle blog, didn’t he? The question about the possible abuse of the Charity law came solely from former NKT members based in the UK, the question was asked in the NK Survivors Forum, and I received some emails about this. This has nothing to do with the Dalai Lama. HHDL is very relaxed with WSS and NKT, he said he is “extremely happy that they can enjoy freedom of speech.” at anther occasion he joked that he feels happy “that some of the protesters may experience some holiday.”

    So if NKT critics falsely accuse you, it is very good to correct them, however, this has nothing to do with the Dalai Lama. [No matter how much Khyenrab or Geshe-la claim the Dalai Lama would be the "sole creator" of the problems, such a claim is always untrue (remind the four Noble Truths).]

    However, thank you for your contribution. I think people will make up their own minds and quite likely we will hear in the future what the CC has decided with respect to that.

    I think there are many good results with respect for ‘Free Tibet’ one is that there was no extensive blood shed from the side of the Tibetans by going into a guerilla war, and the Tibetan community has become quite a successful refugee community which can be a good example for other refugee communities. Imagine the Tibetan exile community would be as desperate as the Palestinians.

    Pico Iyer comments:

    This has made the Tibetan exile community one of the success stories among refugee groups in recent decades. But no less important, perhaps, it has offered a possibility to many others on a planet where there are, by some counts, as many as 33 million official and unofficial refugees. By showing how Tibet can exist internally, in spirit and imagination, even if it is barely visible on the map, the Dalai Lama has been suggesting to Palestinians, Kurds and Uighurs that they can maintain a cultural community even if they have lost their territory. Communities can be linked not by common soil so much as by common ground, a common foundation.

    http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1723922,00.html

    HH the Dalai Lama has a long-term perspective and he follows a middle way approach, he has already many Chinese friends and even the family of one of the former CP leaders asked him for prayers when this CP leader died (I forgot the name of this person but this CP leader also said they made big mistakes with respect to Tibet). Sometimes changes come slowly but they come. The point is that HHDL and the Tibetans may have at this point no result with respect to a free or independent Tibet or a real autonomous territory but this does not mean that there are no results, there are, and if one investigates these one can see how much these good results are due to the kindness of the Dalai Lama – this includes to open the Tibetans for democracy (btw, it was HHDL who did this), to establish schools, modern education (which also the 13th Dalai Lama tried but whose engagement was undermined by the conservative or aristocrat-loyal Gelug establishment), medicine schools etc., to establish a healthy structure where this society, these people, their culture and Tibetan Buddhism can survive, including the monasteries in exile. This includes so many activities including to receive the refugees from Tibet who often in the presence of HHDL and based on their desperate suffering state break down in tears in front of him. Do you know what hard and tied schedule HHDL has daily and that Westerners said they could not cope with it even for two days? And what does HHDL comment on this? He always fears to not have worked hard enough for his people. Guess why the Tibetans love him? Because he is working tirelessly, and selflessly and from the perspective of the benefit of the majority of his people. Even if some Tibetans think he may not be a good politician, they love & respect him very much. Also Geshe-la owes him a lot, don’t he? Where was Geshe-la cured when he had tuberculosis, where could he continue his studies after his exile, why the Indians were so selfless in their support of the Tibetans in Exile – all this has to do with HH the Dalai Lama. Let’s remember the kindness of the Dalai Lama for a while… BTW also Geshe-la came to the West after Lama Yeshe and Lama Zopa approached the Dalai Lama for advice (see Kay’s paper.) So even the presence of Geshe-la to his Western followers is due to the kindness of the Dalai Lama. Maybe Geshe-la will write more about this in his next book as an example of the kindness of others in his own life ;-) Personally I think this would be the better way to leave this world than to leave the world with a distorted version of history and facts as the presentation of things like “A Great Deception : Persecution, corruption, dictatorship, betrayal…” but maybe, and sadly, it is already too late for a such a shift.

    However, back to topic, if NKT critics (former NKT members like I) got it wrong (with respect of the possible charity status abuse), it has to do with them, not with the “Dalai Lama’s hypocrisy”, because these are their thoughts and claims, not those of HHDL. I hope at one point you will understand this.

    Again, thank you so far. I wish you a happy New Year!

    

    tenpel

    December 28, 2009 at 9:44 pm

    Reply
    • Oh, by the way – It’s true what Geshe Kelsang says. The Dorje Shugden issue is a Tibetan political problem. It arises from the Dalai Lama’s political ambition to be the head of Tibetan Buddhism and has nothing to do with Dharma or religion. The Dalai Lama is feathering his own samsaric, worldly nest by merging all schools of Tibetan Buddhism under his leadership in an attempt to improve his own power and influence.

      As you quoted, Geshe Kelsang says:

      I can guarantee that the NKT and myself have never performed inappropriate actions and will never do so in the future, this is our determination.

      This is true. NKT is not the WSS, but WSS doesn’t perform inappropriate actions either because it’s simply defending a pure spiritual tradition from political attack by the Dalai Lama.

      Just some clarification.

      

      Lineageholder

      December 29, 2009 at 9:46 am

      Reply
      • LH, if you had some knowledge about Tibetan Buddhism, your idea of “merging” the four Tibetan Buddhist school into one and making oneself the head of it would collapse, but since you lack knowledge and are under the influence of ill-informed people who mainly see all things based on anger and delusion – which undermines discriminating intelligence – you come to such absurd consequences as expressed here.

        What you see as “clarifications” I see as confusion.

        Of course, I know, Geshe-la thinks he has never done anything wrong, he and NKT are innocent victims, wrong or (in his own words) “guilty” and the “sole creator” of problems are always other people, be it Dechen, the Dalai Lama, Lucy James or whoever. This is the world of NKT as it is known to me.

        Another mark of this world is to spin the facts, of course WSS is NKT or NKT is WSS they are of one entity, and of course they perform inappropriate actions. But I see no reason to explain this again, since I did it already.

        Another perspective you could try to understand is, that actually, with your own words, HHDL is “defending a pure spiritual tradition from political attack” because Je Tsongkhapa’s tradition has no Shugden worship, it was “mixed in” and derives from the Sakya school, as also Vajrayogini praxis was “mixed in”. As a pure purist you should condemn such mixture, shouldn’t you? Since Shugden kills or harms those who “mix” different traditions, actually he is oppressing religious freedom, hence HHDL is restoring religious freedom and he is “defending a pure spiritual tradition from political attack” by Pabongkha Rinpoche who was already scolded for this practice by the 13th Dalai Lama…

        

        tenpel

        December 29, 2009 at 12:15 pm
11. Hi TP,

    As usual, you act as the Dalai Lama’s apologist. You defend the Dalai Lama in glowering terms which, if they were applied to defend Geshe Kelsang, would draw comments from some Tibetan Buddhists loyal to the Dalai Lama that the defender was a ‘brainwashed cultist’. Such double standards!

    As to the critics of the NKT, I think you will probably find that those people who are ex-NKT who feel strongly enough to criticise their ex-tradition (such as NKT ‘Survivors’) are still Buddhists and are probably following a Tibetan tradition of Buddhism like yourself. Who is the self-appointed Leader of Tibetan Buddhism? The Dalai Lama. These days Tibetan Buddhism serves the Dalai Lama’s political ambitions and people like yourself are doing his work – what a sad situation. My point is you cannot say that criticism of the NKT, as expressed in your blog post, is unrelated to the Dalai Lama and his expressed views. Many people’s faith in Kadampa Buddhism has been destroyed by two things: the Dalai Lama’s outspoken negative views of Dorje Shugden and the weight that his opinions hold in the Buddhist world due to his charisma and positive public image. People cannot even conceive that he is duplicitous and self-serving. His followers denounce the NKT as a cult and many people have turned away from the NKT because they believe this to be true. Why do they believe it? Because they have faith in the Dalai Lama.

    Therefore, we can say that in part, many ex-NKTers have the Dalai Lama to thank for their broken faith and negative attitudes towards Dorje Shugden and the NKT. The Dalai Lama’s views, informed by his high reputation, are like a cancer of non-faith that has grown in their minds and we can say that their actions are inspired, at least in part, by his negative views. Those people who claim that the Dalai Lama has no power or influence over the NKT, and therefore why does NKT feel the need to defend itself have either not understood this truth or are deliberately ignoring it. The Dalai Lama’s sole mission is to destroy the practice of Dorje Shugden, whether it is practised in Tibetan society or in the West. Since NKT is a Shugden practising tradition, it suffers from the Dalai Lama’s evangelical zeal in carrying out this mission.

    By the way, it is completely false that Geshe Kelsang is in the West due to the Dalai Lama. Lama Yeshe consulted Trijang Rinpoche who asked Geshe Kelsang to come to England. The Dalai Lama had nothing to do with it and the brief mention that Lama Yeshe and Lama Zopa consulted the Dalai Lama in Kay’s book is the only place I’ve ever seen this claim. It’s completely unsubstantiated.

    Happy new year to you, too! I pray that 2010 will see peace begin to grow in the Buddhist community instead of accusation and division. Perhaps if the Dalai Lama were to stop his war against Dorje Shugden practitioners we could all live in peace. I have to say, though, I don’t think this will happen.

    

    Lineageholder

    December 29, 2009 at 9:35 am

    Reply
    • To see the really existing qualities of someone does not make one to an apologist or cultist. I allowed myself to share some perspectives with you, which you may not get within NKT. If you don’t like that, no problem. Mainly remembering the kindness of others is a Buddhist practice, there is nothing wrong with this.

      With respect to your claim, the Dalai Lama would be the “self-appointed leader of Tibetan Buddhism”, I cannot understand how he did that. When he lived as a farmer boy in a remote region of Tibet, was he calling there for attention “Hello, I am the self-appointed leader of Tibetan Buddhism!” or chose others him to be the religious and political leader of Tibet? That he kindly accepted that burden and works hard – not only for Tibetans but also the world – is something I cannot criticize.

      I am not able to do his work, maybe you have a too positive impression of me, I am completely unable to do the work of HHDL; not only this I lack all his amazing qualities: his humour, his great compassion, his humbleness, knowledge & wisdom &&&& [ok, I stop, you don't like to hear this ;-)]

      I agree with you, of course as you say what I say on my blog is not unrelated to the Dalai Lama, how can it be unrelated, since everything is dependent arising and things are interconnected? But also what I say is related to Geshe-la and NKT and you and and many many other causes and conditions. Everything is dependent arising, e.g. without the thoughts and emails of former NKT members from UK, who are thinking or concerned about a possible Charity abuse by NKT, and without Geshe-la’s command to set up the protests and the WSS there wouldn’t be such a post or discussion where you can add now your comments, would it?

      You claim “Many people’s faith in Kadampa Buddhism has been destroyed by two things: the Dalai Lama’s outspoken negative views of Dorje Shugden and the weight that his opinions hold in the Buddhist world due to his charisma and positive public image.”

      I don’t think this is true. My faith was destroyed by Geshe-la’s own actions and others’ faith was destroyed when they found out how much hate there is against the Dalai Lama and how inappropriate the protests are. Then a lot of faith was destroyed by the sexual abuses within the organisation and the covering up and oppression of its discussion by the NKT leadership. Other reasons why people’s faith was destroyed include the destructive and dishonest (cultish) structure of NKT itself.

      You say: “People cannot even conceive that he [HHDL] is duplicitous and self-serving.”

      Of course they cannot because a “duplicitous and self-serving” attitude of the Dalai Lama is a non-existent like the horns of a rabbit. Only for NKT followers, PRC, Trimondis and Goldner such an attitude seems to be an existent.

      No not “His followers denounce the NKT as a cult” but former NKT followers like I, or Dorje, or David, and many many others have portrayed NKT as a cult. Remember what Dorje said to you different times… Based on NKT’s own actions and websites many people who do not know NKT also started to think NKT may be a “cult”. Please don’t put a spin on the facts. (Just to accuse someone or a group to be a cult is not enough that the group is perceived to be a cult. e.g. Gen-la Kelsang Dekyong accused HHDL to be a cult leader but you can see not many people share that idea nor are there HHDL survivors ;-)

      If now “many people have turned away from the NKT because they believe this to be true.” it is their decision and the question is on what they based their decision, maybe they have good reasons for it maybe not. E.g. the person who runs the website about the Shugden history is a Shugden follower but he left NKT due to NKT’s strong Anti-Dalai Lama stance. This has clearly something to do with the attitudes of NKT.

      As I said, people will make up their own minds. Some people even suggest nowadays to have a look on your own websites to understand the demerits of NKT. They do not even need to explain why they object NKT or feel it is a rather harmful organisation. All this has nothing to do with “faith in the Dalai Lama” nor his objections with respect to Shugden but with NKT itself, NKT’s structure, NKT’s own actions. (Though of course I cannot deny it is possible that for a newcomer of Buddhism, the strong encouragement to not practice Shugden by HHDL may also form a basis to not get involved from the very beginning with NKT. On the other hand many people reported they had entered NKT without knowing about Shugden and were encouraged from the very beginning by NKT to practice Shugden without making them aware about the controversy of that practice. So from another perspective, at least people may have heard before checking NKT about possible problems…)

      “Therefore, we can say that mainly, many ex-NKTers have the NKT and Geshe-la to thank for their broken faith and negative attitudes towards Dorje Shugden and the NKT.” Geshe Kelsang’s views, supported by his exclusive and autocrat leadership within NKT “are like a cancer of non-faith that has grown in [his followers] minds and we can say that their actions are inspired, at least in part, by his negative views. [bla bla].”

      I don’t think that “the Dalai Lama’s sole mission is to destroy the practice of Dorje Shugden” but his responsibility is to warn about demerits of a practice which is perceived or judged to be harmful, and as a person taking care for the welfare of the majority of Tibetans, he cannot ignore its sectarian nature and potential harm for living together in harmony and peace.

      Its interesting to read that you think that always NKT is harmed by others, mainly by the Dalai Lama, but you seem not to perceive the harm that NKT has done and is doing to others – Karma?

      How can you be so sure that this claim is true “By the way, it is completely false that Geshe Kelsang is in the West due to the Dalai Lama. Lama Yeshe consulted Trijang Rinpoche who asked Geshe Kelsang to come to England. The Dalai Lama had nothing to do with it and the brief mention that Lama Yeshe and Lama Zopa consulted the Dalai Lama in Kay’s book is the only place I’ve ever seen this claim. It’s completely unsubstantiated.” This is just a claim of NKT and this claim must be seen in perspective of NKT’s rewriting of history, and dishonesty with facts. According to researcher Kay Geshe Kelsang Gyatso was invited in 1976 by Lama Thubten Yeshe and Lama Zopa Rinpoche, who sought the advice of HH the 14th Dalai Lama when choosing Geshe Kelsang. Based on my own experience with NKT I tend to believe Kay and not NKT, though finally I do not know which version is true but I give Kay far more creditability than NKT.

      Thank you for your wishes for a happy New Year. I hope NKT will learn to act in a way that their actions bring forth the good results they wish, and I hope the same for me and every Buddhist and non-Buddhist.

      

      tenpel

      December 29, 2009 at 1:25 pm

      Reply
12. Do you remember Kelang Gyatso asking Kelsang Pema to organise the demonstrations?
    Do you remember her saying the WSS was an ad hoc group?
    Do you know that the Western Shugden Society is registered as a company at Companies House?
    Do you know it was incorporated on 26/06/2008?
    Do you know she wrote to the House of Commons on behalf of the WSS on 21/07/2008?
    Do you know the Director was named as Helen Gradwell? She resigned on 23/04/2009.
    Do you know she was appointed Secretary on te same date?
    Do you know she resigned on 12/06/2010?
    Nkt Truth announced she had been asked to stand down as Temples Director on 13/06/2010.
    The registered office of WSS changed on 30/06/2010.

    There is a code for the type of company it is registered as and it is;
    (sic(03): 9133.

    So it is a company whose actities are not stated as being religious. These have the code 9131.

    So what is it’s purpose?

    Maybe those who read this site can enlighten me?

    

    modi

    February 1, 2011 at 12:22 am

    Reply

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